From mike@pressroom.com Tue Nov 14 11:04:51 2000 Received: from [216.25.205.27] (helo=pakwan ident=root) by rabbit.burtnet with esmtp (Exim 3.12 #1 (Debian)) id 13viZm-0002l6-00 for ; Tue, 14 Nov 2000 11:04:50 -0500 Received: (from mike@localhost) by pakwan (8.8.8/8.8.8/Debian/GNU) id LAA16613 for nasslug@nasslug.org; Tue, 14 Nov 2000 11:04:47 -0500 Date: Tue, 14 Nov 2000 11:03:47 -0500 From: "Charles M. Fleming" To: nasslug@nasslug.org Message-ID: <20001114110347.A16600@pakwan> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii User-Agent: Mutt/1.0.1i Subject: [NASSLUG] Charter Members Sender: nasslug-admin@nasslug.org Errors-To: nasslug-admin@nasslug.org X-BeenThere: nasslug@nasslug.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.0beta5 Precedence: bulk List-Id: NASS Linux Users Group Reply-To: I am pleased that a NASSLUG has been formed and with this medium at our disposal I am sure that it will facilitate our desire to seek quick advice from time to time and to offer expert help to anyone in NASS who has questions about some facet of computing. Leo Zeggert agreed to give a short presentation at the next Blue Sky Discussion which I hope we can schedule for Thursday 14 December in the afternoon. Please consider giving a presentation and above all please attend the discussion. I would appreciate receiving a description of your presentation, so that I can arrange them in a logical order. Mike From mike@pressroom.com Tue Nov 21 12:09:34 2000 Received: from [199.129.206.40] (helo=pakwan) by rabbit.burtnet with esmtp (Exim 3.12 #1 (Debian)) id 13yGvG-0006Pr-00 for ; Tue, 21 Nov 2000 12:09:34 -0500 Received: from mail.pressroom.com (mike@pakwan [127.0.0.1]) by pakwan (8.8.8/8.8.8/Debian/GNU) with ESMTP id MAA07334 for ; Tue, 21 Nov 2000 12:09:15 -0500 Message-Id: <200011211709.MAA07334@pakwan> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.1.1 10/15/1999 (debian) From: cfleming@pressroom.com To: nasslug@nasslug.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Tue, 21 Nov 2000 12:09:15 -0500 Subject: [NASSLUG] Blue Sky Discussion Sender: nasslug-admin@nasslug.org Errors-To: nasslug-admin@nasslug.org X-BeenThere: nasslug@nasslug.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.0beta5 Precedence: bulk List-Id: NASS Linux Users Group There appears to be some trouble in finding a mutually convenient time to conduct the Blue Sky Discussion. Sam Brunner has a conflict on 12 Dec. Would 11 Dec or 15 Dec be suitable dates for hold this discussion? Mike From mike@bhox.bhox.com Mon Nov 27 14:00:57 2000 Received: from [199.129.206.26] (helo=bhox.bhox.com) by rabbit.burtnet with esmtp (Exim 3.12 #1 (Debian)) id 140TWJ-0004lq-00 for ; Mon, 27 Nov 2000 14:00:56 -0500 Received: (from mike@localhost) by bhox.bhox.com (8.8.8/8.8.8/Debian/GNU) id OAA26212 for nasslug@nasslug.org; Mon, 27 Nov 2000 14:00:50 -0500 Date: Mon, 27 Nov 2000 14:00:50 -0500 From: "Charles M. Fleming" To: nasslug@nasslug.org Message-ID: <20001127140050.A26205@pakwan> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii User-Agent: Mutt/1.0.1i Subject: [NASSLUG] Final Date of Blue Sky Sender: nasslug-admin@nasslug.org Errors-To: nasslug-admin@nasslug.org X-BeenThere: nasslug@nasslug.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.0beta5 Precedence: bulk List-Id: NASS Linux Users Group Reply-To: The second Blue Sky Discussion which Phil Zellers is sponsoring will be held on 15 Dec beginning at 10:00 in room 5309 South Building. The topic of this discussion will focus our attention on Linux and applications of it in NASS. Please attend the discussion. I spread the word among known Linux sympathizers in NASS about www.nasslug.org and the exitence of a mailing list. The more subscribers there are in NASSLUG the easier it will be to disseminate information and get answers to our questions. Mike From mike@bhox.bhox.com Tue Dec 05 15:43:30 2000 Received: from [216.25.205.27] (helo=bhox.bhox.com ident=root) by rabbit.burtnet with esmtp (Exim 3.12 #1 (Debian)) id 143Ovv-0007mP-00 for ; Tue, 05 Dec 2000 15:43:28 -0500 Received: (from mike@localhost) by bhox.bhox.com (8.8.8/8.8.8/Debian/GNU) id PAA22090 for nasslug@nasslug.org; Tue, 5 Dec 2000 15:43:23 -0500 Date: Tue, 5 Dec 2000 15:43:23 -0500 From: "Charles M. Fleming" To: nasslug@nasslug.org Message-ID: <20001205154323.A22045@pakwan> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable User-Agent: Mutt/1.0.1i Subject: [NASSLUG] Text of Blue Sky Discussion Sender: nasslug-admin@nasslug.org Errors-To: nasslug-admin@nasslug.org X-BeenThere: nasslug@nasslug.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.0beta5 Precedence: bulk List-Id: NASS Linux Users Group Reply-To:=20 The following is the text of my presentation which I will deliver at the Bl= ue Sky Discussion. Please give me your comments especially if you see something that is not right. Thank you, Mike Blue Sky Discussion=20 Charles M. Fleming National Agricultural Statistics Service, Washington= , D.C. 20250 =20 Good morning. I am pleased to join this Second Blue Sky Discussion and to h= ave a part in leading it. Its theme can be traced to the continued climb in= popularity of the Linux operating system, and as result the theme was sele= cted in order to bring about a discussion of how Linux can be utilized in N= ASS. To the best of my knowledge, Linux was first introduced into NASS in Octobe= r 1994 when Jim Burt requisitioned a Slackware distribution of Linux. It to= ok awhile to learn how to install Linux and, especially, to make the xterm = window system work. Nonetheless, after a successful initial installation, t= hanks to Jim's efforts, I have been using Linux as my primary platform for = six years. My little 486 which I inherited from Jeff Bailey is more versati= le and reliable than any Pentium computer I know which runs on Windows. At = first, I examined Linux to satisfy my curiosity and need to find a stable= computational environment. It had become a daily practice to reboot my PC = several times in the morning and several times in the afternoon, so somethi= ng better than Windows had to be found. Now I depend on Linux for the immen= se storehouse of utilities which it makes available to me for doing my math= ematical and statistical work. =20 It has co-incidentally provided me with an extremely fertile ground in whi= ch to learn about the many facets of computer science which would otherwise= remain mysterious if I had been restricted to use only a Windows system. L= inux offers opportunities to experiment with new products which typically c= ome well developed and ready to use even in a early stage of development. R= and LaTeX are two good examples of such packages which I now regard as in= dispensable. B Since the lineage of Linux is UNIX, its strength excels in the task of netw= orking computers peer-to-peer. Not surprisingly, a PC having Linux installe= d on it can serve Microsoft Windows and NT software for an entire network t= ransparently to the individual users of the software at a considerable savi= ngs in management for the network administrator. Being a part of the UNIX w= orld, many utilities from the free software community embellished and great= ly improved the UNIX system in Research Division. For example, my 486 PC wa= s rigged to shutdown seven SUN computers, if there was an extensive power f= ailure. Moreover, John Hoge and Leo Zeggert have developed some very impres= sive systems for NASS which are based on Linux. Indeed, provisions for erec= ting a firewall come natively with Linux; fully functional web server and a= nonymous FTP capabilities that come with Linux are the same ones employed b= y the largest sites on the Internet; such systems as secure shell make it p= ossible to protect confidential information in an encrypted file system. Th= us, reaping the culmination of over 30 years of UNIX development helps to e= xplain the success of Linux in becoming a remarkably robust operating syste= m and has essentially become the most up-to-date and widespread version of = UNIX anywhere. Its success can be attributed to the remarkable management of its developme= nt from all corners of the world. By being copyrighted under the terms of t= he General Public License (GPL) which the Free Software Foundation develope= d and champions, the source code of Linux must be made freely available to = anyone. Consequently, anyone can determine how Linux executes a function an= d more importantly the source code can be modified to accommodate a special= need. If the improvement is deemed a good one, it can be submitted to the = Linux community for general implementation. This collaboration among tens o= f thousands of Linux beta testers and contributors has created a developmen= t team of unsurpassed size and talent. As Jim Burt is fond of saying: "Linu= x is International UNIX". Companies like HP, SCO, and SGI have already stop= ped developing their versions of UNIX. Eventually, IBM's Monterey operating= system will be replaced with Linux. Indeed, IBM is actively developing Lin= ux as you already know. I should note that BSD, Free BSD, Net BSD, and HUR= D are in the same camp as Linux in that their source codes are open, in fac= t, you can find features taken wholesale from BSD and put into a Linux dis= tribution.=20 The free cost of Linux is immaterial; rather, its extreme versatility and r= eliability are its main attractions. It is almost an axiom that there is a = way in the Linux world given sufficient ingenuity to overcome a problem. If= I cannot solve a problem, then someone in a Linux Users' Group will come t= o the rescue. That is why, we recently formed a NASS Linux Users' Group whi= ch we call NASSLUG with its own web page and more importantly a mailing lis= t in order to provide a medium through which communications can take place = among Linux users, UNIX users, or anyone else in NASS who has a curiosity = about open source utilities.=20 In order to generate ideas and to assess potential uses of Linux in NASS , = Phil is sponsoring this Blue Sky Discussion.He should be commended for givi= ng us this opportunity to discuss Linux in the company of so many computer = experts from ITD. =20 Phil asked me to lead this discussion to-day and in leading it I will follo= w the rule of recognizing someone when you raise your hand. Please raise y= our hand when you would like to say something, and I will then recognize yo= u so that you may have the floor. Those joining us via the telephone may sa= y something at any time.=20 We will hear Jim Burt, Jason Frederick, and Leo Zeggert talk about some thi= ng associated with Linux which, I am sure, will interest all of us. After = each presentation, I will open the floor to a discussion. The last round, a= fter Leo's talk, can be about any topic regarding Linux. From mike@bhox.bhox.com Thu Dec 07 10:21:37 2000 Received: from [216.25.205.27] (helo=bhox.bhox.com ident=root) by rabbit.burtnet with esmtp (Exim 3.12 #1 (Debian)) id 1442rY-0002zS-00 for ; Thu, 07 Dec 2000 10:21:37 -0500 Received: (from mike@localhost) by bhox.bhox.com (8.8.8/8.8.8/Debian/GNU) id IAA25893 for nasslug@nasslug.org; Thu, 7 Dec 2000 08:35:07 -0500 Date: Thu, 7 Dec 2000 08:35:07 -0500 From: "Charles M. Fleming" To: nasslug@nasslug.org Message-ID: <20001207083507.A25876@pakwan> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii User-Agent: Mutt/1.0.1i Subject: [NASSLUG] Blue Sky Discussion Sender: nasslug-admin@nasslug.org Errors-To: nasslug-admin@nasslug.org X-BeenThere: nasslug@nasslug.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.0beta5 Precedence: bulk List-Id: NASS Linux Users Group Reply-To: I want to thank everyone for giving me comments about my Blue Sky Discussion presentation. I'll see you on Dec 15th. Mike From mike@pressroom.com Fri Dec 08 13:52:53 2000 Received: from [199.129.206.33] (helo=bhox.bhox.com) by rabbit.burtnet with esmtp (Exim 3.12 #1 (Debian)) id 144SdX-0007jc-00 for ; Fri, 08 Dec 2000 13:52:51 -0500 Received: from mail.pressroom.com (mike@pakwan [127.0.0.1]) by bhox.bhox.com (8.8.8/8.8.8/Debian/GNU) with ESMTP id NAA28528 for ; Fri, 8 Dec 2000 13:52:47 -0500 Message-Id: <200012081852.NAA28528@bhox.bhox.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.1.1 10/15/1999 (debian) From: cfleming@pressroom.com To: nasslug@nasslug.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Fri, 08 Dec 2000 13:52:47 -0500 Subject: [NASSLUG] Tripwire Sender: nasslug-admin@nasslug.org Errors-To: nasslug-admin@nasslug.org X-BeenThere: nasslug@nasslug.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.0beta5 Precedence: bulk List-Id: NASS Linux Users Group Jim, What are you using in place of Tripwire? You are using a combination of immutable and something else to prevent any surreptitious changes to a file. What is that something else? Mike From jameson@coost.com Fri Dec 08 23:44:22 2000 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=coost.com ident=jameson) by rabbit.burtnet with esmtp (Exim 3.12 #1 (Debian)) id 144brx-0000m7-00; Fri, 08 Dec 2000 23:44:21 -0500 X-Mailer: exmh version 2.1.1 10/15/1999 (debian) To: cfleming@pressroom.com cc: nasslug@nasslug.org, jameson@coost.com Subject: Re: [NASSLUG] Tripwire In-Reply-To: Message from cfleming@pressroom.com of "Fri, 08 Dec 2000 13:52:47 EST." <200012081852.NAA28528@bhox.bhox.com> References: <200012081852.NAA28528@bhox.bhox.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Fri, 08 Dec 2000 23:44:21 -0500 From: "Jameson C. Burt" Message-Id: Sender: nasslug-admin@nasslug.org Errors-To: nasslug-admin@nasslug.org X-BeenThere: nasslug@nasslug.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.0beta5 Precedence: bulk List-Id: NASS Linux Users Group I use the package/program Aide, which like tripwire makes fancy checksums of every file in a requested list. It does what tripwire did plus, I understand, more. It can, at your option, check for changes in permissions, inode, number of links, user who owns, group who owns, size, modify time, access time, change time, only-growing in size, and a checksum (md5, sha1, rmd160, tiger or all). In different directories, I check different attributes; eg, in /var some files should only increase in size, but their modify time will of coarse change. A couple years ago I ran tripwire on all of many directories, including a 411MB /usr/lib, so tripwire took 1 hour; I have since removed a few large, not crucial, subdirectories from (my now Aide) configuration, so Aide now takes but 3 minutes to gather information on all files my configuration requests. You can see my /etc/aide/aide.conf file in http://www.nasslug.org/somefiles/aide.conf You had properly observed a relation between tripwire/Aide and immutability. I used my Aide configuration, then mostly excluded a few more files, to form my own script looping on "chattr". Concerning your question about immutable files, I use chattr +i filename #applied to many files lcap CAP_LINUX_IMMUTABLE the latter, thru a live kernel modification, preventing any "chattr" changes back until rebooting. I run a hand-made command to do all this, which I call /home/jameson/bin/chattr-security.jameson You can see this file in http://www.nasslug.org/somefiles/chattr-security.jameson-bin I have this script set to ask yes/NO with a 10 second timeout towards the script's end, for which yes would prevent changing immutability back until rebooting. If your boot script always ran "lcap CAP_LINUX_IMMUTABLE" on booting, you could never change numerous files ---so you would eventually want to undo this by something like a boot off CD, mounting your disk's filesystem with /etc/init.d/*, and there altering your boot script with "chattr". If you run such a boot script, you must be careful to prevent odd errors on booting. I had made /etc and a few of its files immutable, but little known to me, booting needed to temporarily create files like /etc/mtab~23. Since the inode /etc was immutable I got booting errors I had never seen, so I had to "chattr -i /etc" and reboot. While largely unimportant and uninteresting, I run this script through Linux's init system on bootup/shutdown, via the file /etc/init.d/chattr-security.jameson which I put (for your viewing) in http://www.nasslug.org/somefiles/chattr-security.jameson The magical part is what I had never seen before on any computer system, but I now understand is also on BSD unix: lcap. > Jim, > > What are you using in place of Tripwire? You are using a combination of > immutable and something else to prevent any surreptitious changes to a file. > What is that something else? > > Mike > -- Jameson C. Burt, NJ9L Fairfax, Virginia, USA jameson@coost.com http://www.coost.com (202) 690-0380 (work) You can only find truth with logic if you have already found truth without it. -- G.K. Chesterton From mike@bhox.bhox.com Wed Jan 03 11:50:09 2001 Received: from [216.25.205.27] (helo=bhox.bhox.com ident=root) by rabbit.burtnet with esmtp (Exim 3.12 #1 (Debian)) id 14Dr70-0003nJ-00 for ; Wed, 03 Jan 2001 11:50:08 -0500 Received: (from mike@localhost) by bhox.bhox.com (8.8.8/8.8.8/Debian/GNU) id LAA20446 for nasslug@nasslug.org; Wed, 3 Jan 2001 11:49:54 -0500 Date: Wed, 3 Jan 2001 11:49:54 -0500 From: "Charles M. Fleming" To: nasslug@nasslug.org Message-ID: <20010103114954.A20421@pakwan> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii User-Agent: Mutt/1.0.1i Subject: [NASSLUG] Bluesky Proceedings Sender: nasslug-admin@nasslug.org Errors-To: nasslug-admin@nasslug.org X-BeenThere: nasslug@nasslug.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.0beta5 Precedence: bulk List-Id: NASS Linux Users Group Reply-To: The Blue Sky Discussion seems to have produced interest about the use of Linux in NASS. I have received some inquiries since then about joining the mailing list. Phil Zellers prefers that the Proceedings of the Blue Sky Discussion be circulated over the NASS Bulletin Board. I plan to work up an html and PDF versions of the proceedings. A Postscript version exists already but the graphics are in color which makes the printing of it a long process; it takes about 30 minutes to make a paper copy of the Proceedings. Nonetheless, I can easily make a copy having no graphics. Stop by my office: 5867 for a copy or call me at: 202-690-8820. I will not have an opportunity to create a version suitable for display on the web page until next week. When it is finished, perhaps we can inform others in the Agency of its existence. The essays that comprise the Proceedings are well done and they deserve to be disseminated. Mike From jameson@coost.com Wed Jan 03 13:02:26 2001 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=coost.com ident=jameson) by rabbit.burtnet with esmtp (Exim 3.12 #1 (Debian)) id 14DsF0-0004F1-00; Wed, 03 Jan 2001 13:02:26 -0500 X-Mailer: exmh version 2.1.1 10/15/1999 (debian) From: "Jameson C. Burt" To: nasslug@nasslug.org cc: jameson@byyt.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Wed, 03 Jan 2001 13:02:26 -0500 Message-Id: Subject: [NASSLUG] NSA codes "Secure Linux", Russians use Egghead credit card numbers Sender: nasslug-admin@nasslug.org Errors-To: nasslug-admin@nasslug.org X-BeenThere: nasslug@nasslug.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.0beta5 Precedence: bulk List-Id: NASS Linux Users Group The National Security Agency (NSA) released to the open source community the code for their "Secure Linux" project. The story can be found in January 3, 2001, of http://www.linuxtoday.com, or more specifically, http://linuxtoday.com/news_story.php3?ltsn=2001-01-03-001-21-SC-HE-SV (though email might make this latter URL unuseable). While one wouldn't want to use this NSA code directly, some of it will probably be incorporated by Linux developers. The NSA action represents government's need for secure operating systems. Within the military, there are numerous computers that are prohibited from having any commercial software. These actions by the military might be reflected in last month's Russian entry into Microsoft. Microsoft stated that they thought little code had been removed. That statement reminds me of Egghead/Onsale's email to me two weeks ago stating that their computers had been compromised, but "We have no information at this time to suggest that any credit card information has been compromised" Last week, I looked at my Indiana credit union account online, noticing a $10.50 charge from Global Telecom, Moscow I notified my credit union of this bogus credit card charge, for which they sent me a complaint form. Today my credit union informed me that they have hundreds of these charges appearing just in their credit union. All their credit card numbers had been used before with Egghead. Two years ago, I felt computer security was oversold by those who never saw internet's openness and useability in the mid-1980's. But with stories like the above and the nightly parade of attacks on nasslug.org, I now sit down for a security match (like a checkers match) every night. This week, I have seen others computers taken over, then their computers used to try cracking into nasslug.org. The logs in nasslug.org show attacks on ports 111 (remote procedure call), 23 (telnet), 21 (ftp), ... I have seen hijacked computers controlled by the same user with the same trail from numerous countries: Russia (of course!), Israel (Russian emigrees?), Korea, Hong Kong, Poland, US, ... I sent logs to the CERT security center and informed those who oversaw the involved IP numbers. If you have a DSL or a cable connection at home, you can presume you're getting probed nightly. For some perspective, if there are 300 million computer users and only 1 in 10,000 tries to crack into others' computers, that would represent 30,000 crackers. And since crackers use prewritten scripts that can attack a million computers a night [I wrote a script that querried the whois DNS registry 500,000 times a day], expect them trying to breach your computer. We can all thank NSA for its contributions to computer security. -- Jameson C. Burt, NJ9L Fairfax, Virginia, USA jameson@coost.com http://www.coost.com (202) 690-0380 (work) You can only find truth with logic if you have already found truth without it. -- G.K. Chesterton From mike@pressroom.com Fri Jan 05 18:37:58 2001 Received: from [199.129.206.42] (helo=bhox.bhox.com) by rabbit.burtnet with esmtp (Exim 3.12 #1 (Debian)) id 14EgQn-0004pi-00 for ; Fri, 05 Jan 2001 18:37:57 -0500 Received: from mail.pressroom.com (mike@pakwan [127.0.0.1]) by bhox.bhox.com (8.8.8/8.8.8/Debian/GNU) with ESMTP id SAA25339 for ; Fri, 5 Jan 2001 18:37:45 -0500 Message-Id: <200101052337.SAA25339@bhox.bhox.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.1.1 10/15/1999 (debian) From: cfleming@pressroom.com To: nasslug@nasslug.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Fri, 05 Jan 2001 18:37:45 -0500 Subject: [NASSLUG] HTML Editor Sender: nasslug-admin@nasslug.org Errors-To: nasslug-admin@nasslug.org X-BeenThere: nasslug@nasslug.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.0beta5 Precedence: bulk List-Id: NASS Linux Users Group I found a discussion of HTML editors on the DCLUG mailing list. One promising editor is Bluefish. It was highly recommended and of the little time I spent investigating it, Bluefish may be worth studying. Here is a brief discription of Bluefish: Description: A Gtk+ HTML editor Bluefish is a GTK HTML editor for the experienced web designer. It is currently in alpha stage, but still usable. Its features include nice wizards for startup, tables and frame; a fully featured image insert dialog; and thumbnail creation and automatically linking of the thumbnail with the original image. . For validation to work you need weblint. For preview to work, you need a web browser that can view local files given to it on the command line. Mike From mike@pressroom.com Tue Jan 09 18:40:00 2001 Received: from [216.25.205.27] (helo=bhox.bhox.com ident=root) by rabbit.burtnet with esmtp (Exim 3.12 #1 (Debian)) id 14G8Mx-0006ge-00 for ; Tue, 09 Jan 2001 18:39:59 -0500 Received: from mail.pressroom.com (mike@pakwan [127.0.0.1]) by bhox.bhox.com (8.8.8/8.8.8/Debian/GNU) with ESMTP id SAA07081 for ; Tue, 9 Jan 2001 18:37:26 -0500 Message-Id: <200101092337.SAA07081@bhox.bhox.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.1.1 10/15/1999 (debian) From: cfleming@pressroom.com To: nasslug@nasslug.org In-reply-to: Your message of "Tue, 09 Jan 2001 15:45:02 EST." Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Tue, 09 Jan 2001 18:37:26 -0500 Subject: [NASSLUG] Re: NASSLUG.org closing this weekend: management request Sender: nasslug-admin@nasslug.org Errors-To: nasslug-admin@nasslug.org X-BeenThere: nasslug@nasslug.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.0beta5 Precedence: bulk List-Id: NASS Linux Users Group Jim, I am sorry that nasslug.org is being shut down. The reasons for creating it are well founded. Of course, if nasslug.org is owned by a private concern little can be done to stop its broadcast, so to speak. Funny, there are LUG's associated with high schools and univerities which flourish. Count me in on a govlug.org site. Mike